There is no universally recognized favorite player in Survivor history, but there is most definitely a core group of fan favorites that appear on lists over and over again. At or near the top are the show’s only two-time winners Sandra Diaz-Twine and Tony Vlachos. They’re both royalty in the Survivor community, but apparently, if they applied to go to Fiji today, host Jeff Probst wouldn’t cast them.

At least that’s the implication many are taking from comments the longtime face of Survivor made. He recently sat for an interview at a live event, and a portion of the conversation was recorded by The Ankler. In the clip, Probst mentions Tony and Sandra as good examples of villains. He says they were awesome once upon a time, but now that the game has evolved, he’s trying to bring in different sorts of people that bring more “joy.” You can check out the portion of his quote quickly spreading around the fanbase below…

Now, some fans feel like he’s implying Tony and Sandra are assholes in the above quote. I get where those fans are coming from, but I wouldn’t take it that far. I don’t think he meant to imply two of the game’s greatest players, who he has consistently praised over the years, are assholes. I do, however, think he’s saying people like them wouldn’t fit in the modern game, and that’s an obvious problem with the modern game. You can watch the full clip below, which begins abruptly and without context and judge for yourself…

In what should be a surprise to absolutely no one, many fans are not pleased with Probst’s comments. Obviously the ones who think he was calling them assholes are not happy campers, but there are also many who are just confused about why he wouldn’t be desperate to find more players like them. Others are expressing more general frustration about the fact that they want more villains or that the show has become “nicest person left standing.” Even some former players have come out and said they don’t really understand where Jeff is coming from with these comments.

It’s not exactly a hot take to say the Survivor fanbase hasn’t been particularly happy with the last ten seasons of the show. Those on social media have been pretty loud in saying they’re not happy with the direction, and that frustration has extended to many journalists covering the reality competition, as well as more casual fans I speak to in real life. There is a collective sense that Survivor has lost its edge and gotten way too nice.

You could point to the shortened game, the editing style that highlights players growing or learning something or the tendency to cast superfans who are happy to be there. More often than not, however, fans simplify the problem by saying there’s a lack of villains. Almost all of the narrative structure of the show is around the challenges, the strategy around the votes and the personal emotional journeys of the contestants. Once upon a time, it was a lot more about interpersonal conflict that often resulted in clashes at camp and mean-spirited confessionals.

Probst has, over the last few years, waffled a bit in his stance about villains. Sometimes he’s come out and said he flat out does not want villains on the show. Sometimes he’s come out and said he doesn’t want mean-spirited villains but does want cutthroat players like Parvati, Tony and Sandra. Now, he seems to be implying even Sandra and Tony take things too far. In the same interview, he pointed to Savannah and Genevieve as more modern players he thinks play a villainous style that he approves of.

Personally I’d much rather see villains of all sorts back on Survivor. I want the Tony and Sandra types, but I also want the Russell Hantz, Richard Hatch, Chaos Kass, Randy Bailey, Courtney Yates and Abi-Maria Gomes types too. I want people that stir the pot, but even if we don’t get that, it sounds like change is coming to Survivor sooner rather than later.

Probst announced the next season of the show will start the so-called Open Era, which will make the game more unpredictable. We’ll also be getting another returnee season, probably during 53 or 54. Fingers crossed he surprises everyone and bring back Sandra or Tony or another one of the OG villains.